[Solved] Fathers, you can't win.

The only as thing fathers cant win at is alienation the mother has that child for so much longer and can influence a child's thoughts,what happens when the child gets to 10 and they dont want to go to dad's house to keep mother happy the court start asking the child at that age

You might find this recent article a good read...

http://www.familylawweek.co.uk/site.aspx?i=ed161124

Courts in this country have been slow to react to PA but things are changing hopefully.

Good call ACTD that's what I've realised seeing as I have my daughter every weekend she misses out on time with her mum and sister along with time with her cousins and aunts ect I try and involve myself with family gatherings ect as much as I can but then on the other hand mum enjoys the break and her sister loves having time alone with mum.

My daughter actually sees more of my side of her family than her own so it evens out really I think that's why no matter how hostile and bitter the ex is towards you, you should always ignore it and try and work with her for the sake of your child my ex was the cow bag from [censored] for 2 years solid and I just chipped away at her until finally she calmed down you wouldn't belive it had happened as we're back to being friends again just been to our 3rd family music festival together.

Why is it if we have 50/50 care I still pay maintenance she gets the child benefit and child tax credit? Seems like equality is a myth in this situation!

I've just read through all of the posts on this thread.

To be honest, I don't know what to believe. I would like to be able to say that there is hope, that the system is just and fair. That despite the failures, there are many success stories. The statistics that have been quoted are daunting and depressing yet I still can't find any statistics anywhere that relate to cases since the amendments to the childrens act. The courts are supposed to now be treating the best interests of the child as paramount but where is the proof?

I have still yet to go to court. My ordeal is only just beginning and I feel as though the last nine months have been only the gates of [censored] - the rest is yet to come.

I am lucky that I had the foresight to record as much evidence as possible to both show what the mother of my children is like and that her allegations were false. I would recommend that every father new to this situation does the same - it is not illegal. I intend to go for full custody - I've given the mother every possible chance to play fair and be amicable. I have video evidence of her trying to deny contact from day one.

I've weighed up every conceivable outcome to this unfortunate situation. I can only try my hardest to do what is right and fair and pray that "the system" and the people that represent it really can see the that fathers have been getting the short end of the stick for too long and because of that the children lose out too. I have no doubt that many of the fathers on this site and elsewhere take great pride in their children and have lots to offer them. I'm sure there are many terrible fathers too - mine was.

I read about fathers who get the result they wanted but that result equates to one or two days access - to me this isn't success. My children are a part of me, they fill me with joy and love and we are on a journey together. Anything less than equal access to them (for me) is wrong - there isn't a person in this world (safeguarding issues aside) that has the right to deny our relationship. To go from having them around me for seven days a week to even six days a week is a disappointment.

Don't accept second best, don't let the system treat you like you're anything less than a father. Don't allow the system to let your children suffer the denial of contact that mothers dish out. The only person this benefits is the mother.

I really think it has got a lot to do with how you approach the courts and conduct yourself in court I like most dads flew in there saying the ex has done this that and the other producing evidence of the ex's wrong doing ect and it doesn't really make any difference I swear solicitors make it worse and just drag it all out for their own gain.

I recently went to court again and gained full custody of my girl and even though they reversed the order and sent her back to Mum I came out with a rock solid order with 50/50 shared care, this time round I hardly mentioned the ex and solely concentrated on my girl. I've been helping out many dads and the ones who have listened and conducted themselves properly have ALL gained decent access to their children.

All the best

Slim 🙂

Why is it if we have 50/50 care I still pay maintenance she gets the child benefit and child tax credit? Seems like equality is a myth in this situation!

It depends what CSA scheme you're on... With the new scheme, if you can prove you have the child equally, say by producing a court order, then you don't have to pay Maintenance. If you don't have a court order it's much harder to prove, unless the mother is reasonable and truthful with the CMS.

If you're on an earlier scheme, then you will have toward til you're moved over to the new scheme, which is happening with all older cases over the next couple of years.

I've just agreed to carry on paying what maintenance I was paying even though I've got 50/50 which is nearly double what I should be paying if I never seen my girl, It just keeps the peace I know my ex relies on it and I know she won't kick up a fuss whilst the moneys rolling in, it also feels good providing for my girl.

So, four months down the line and things moved from bad to worse.

Backstory..... The mother applied for to take our daughter to Ireland permanently as i wouldn't let her move in to my tenanted flat, due to the fact i saw her for the free loading witch she is. I have always fully supported my daughter and wanted to be a part of her life and be involved in her upbringing and welfare. I at no point have tried to take her away from the mother as i understand that is an important bond. However, i do have concerns as the mother has a history of mental health issues, attempted suicide and arrests for numerous drunken assaults.

The final court hearing saw CAFCASS torn to pieces in the witness box. The 'officer' was changing her mind at the drop of a hat, completely going back on what she had written in her section 7 report two weeks earlier, rambling about prior cases and irrelevant topics, so much so that my representative and the judge had to politely ask her not to deviate from what was being asked. She made a fool of herself and it was very evident she was out of her depth, calling in to question her professional judgement. It transpired that this was her first case at CAFCASS and it shew. The officer had simply mirrored the mothers statements in her report.

The mother took the stand and it was pitiful. My representative was very tactile and didn't belittle her or make her look stupid. She simply uncovered the facts in a very professional manner and for the first time in 8 months i knew why it had cost me £££££. The barrister was amazing. Completely discredited the mother and her fictional statements which were an emotive pile of ramblings and falsities.

My case was presented fairly, proportionately and I believe my barrister couldn't have done a better job. We broke for lunch and the results were to be heard after lunch. i was in high spirits and knew it had gone well. I really felt i would be enjoying the father daughter bond in no time.......how fu**ing wrong was I.

The final result being she can go to Ireland in five weeks (from date of hearing) not 4 months, i have to attend contact centre another three times (already had 4 sessions there and it's grim), the mother is to include my surname in our daughter to be effected immediately (small bonus), i am to spend the two days a week i get off having my daughter for three hours only for the next 5 weeks until she leaves the uk, every other month i am to travel to ireland to see my daughter for 6hrs on two consecutive days but not overnight, every other month she is to come to the uk, these trips are to align with my variable work rota (policeman).

Essential the judge mirrored CAFCASS's conclusion. I was to have intense contact with my daughter until she left and then after that i can see her for 12hrs a month but not overnight. Contact was painful before she left as th mother did all she can to make it [censored]. She would drop her off with the clothes on her back, wouldn't tell me when she was last fed or changed etc. She used her as a pawn to sell herself on dating websites, wouldn't turn up, would threaten me with non molestation orders as she hated the fact i was getting time with our daughter. She has refused to make our daughter available in line with the court order at the stated location in Ireland. She has refused to bring her back to the UK in line with the court order. She has refused to change my daughters name in line with the court order. The mother continues to be a disgusting human being and has pushed my family and i to emotionally breaking causing severe distress and upset to all.

I went back to court with all the evidence to show the mother is refusing to comply with the court order set. Essentially the judge told me it was my behaviour despite having not spoken with me EVER and knowing nothing about me. All he had to go on was the mothers lies and deceit. He wasn't interested in the black and white evidence i was providing to show how obstructive the mother was (she is stupid enough to write everything in emails). He did nothing to enforce the order despite the evidence i provided and ordered i pay half the mothers travel costs to get to the UK. She pulls a figure out of her ar$e of £450 which the judge agrees with. Absolutely ludicrous. The only question the mother asked in court was "when will i get my money"

Now i don't see my daughter and probably never will. I have had to pay half her costs which i believe he ordered as a deterant so i don't bring it back to court.
I'm sorry but i am a good, honest, hardworking member of society. I pay taxes and have made more than my contribution to this country with an extensive military background and this is ho it repays me. Yes, it takes two to make a baby but only one to be lying, deceitful and money grabbing . My daughter is 1 year old in two weeks and you can count the hours on one hand that i have seen her in this time. The system is a joke.

Without knowing all the facts of the case, this sounds like a farce. Take some further legal advice from a solicitor / barrister and look at taking this higher if you can. I've been involved in similar cases and have never seen anything like this.

I think we're all pretty speechless at this outcome...it's an injustice and you have been sorely let down. She has played the system and was lucky enough to land in front of a judge that was too weak and incompetent to take hold of the case and deal with it properly.... unfortunately there are judges that don't deserve their position.

I would see if there is a chance of appealing this decision, that can be costly and hard emotionally, as you've lost faith in the system, so discuss it with you solicitor and get their opinion. There's only a three week window in which to act.

The only other option is to leave it 6 months and re apply.

I'm so sorry it has ended like this ... all the best.

@Mr Slim - Absolute utter utter rubbish

Prove it!

I bet that you can't. Countless personal experiences on here and many other sites in conjunction with official statistics will prevent you.

Example question : How many mothers have been jailed for complicity in their children's truancy and then how many mothers have been jailed for illegally breaking the terms of contact orders?