[Solved] Wife planning to move with children

Hi

I'm afraid generally, the courts won't grant the PSO in these circumstances unless the move is purely to prevent contact - in your ex's case, moving to be near her family would be seen as a genuine reason for moving. The exception is if she is moving to another country - Scotland and England are different countries for this purpose.

Moving 227 miles away is going to greatly limit contact to once in a blue moon for me (generally school holidays), as time and costs for weekend visits would be restrictive, and no chance for mid-week contact. I would not be able to attend school events, parent evenings, sports day, etc.

My son is settled in current school, and has close family and friends in local area. It will be disruptive to him to be up-rooted.

Not sure how this will play out but in one of my hearings the judge was adamant that the children should not be moved from their school when the parents are separating. I would go and speak to a solicitor as soon as you can, but my guess is that you have a pretty good chance of getting an order in place. Go and speak to the school and let them know your concerns. in my case the ex was threatening to move them to a different school near her mums, only 15 miles away but this all blow up in her face when we ended up in court.

Are you able to do the school runs currently?

I have seen a couple of solicitors, that wouldn't give a straight opinion of my chances. 50-50 it seems so far.

I can drop them off at school at get to work okay, but can't frequently pick them up myself after school. Youngest is in pre-school and finishes at 12:45! Next September, they would both be at the same junior school 9-3, and I could justify working from home one or two afternoons.

I am really looking for Shared Residence with a chance to see them one or two evenings in the week, and weekends.

I've prepared the C100 form and teetering on the edge of submitting tomorrow, LIP, but it's all a bit daunting, and don't know what the outcome could be. Court could order something quite different to what I am looking for, eg. ask me to move out, if the wife cannot move up north.

I would personally start to take up as much of the morning runs as you can. I'm guessing once you submit the C100 and the ex knows she'll try to stop this. Also, organise playdates with the childrens friends and put the ex to the back of your mind, start living a life you want with your kids and create memories they will cherish when they're older.

I currently have a shared interim order in place, so it's doable! just keep everything amicable and reasonable between you both. Don't do anything that will later bite you in the [censored].

There is no way the judge can order you out of the house without an Occupation Order, so I wouldn't worry too much. I'm guessing the only exception is claims of DV. I never thought my ex would do that but at the end she was willing to throw anything at me so don't be surprised if she does. Protect yourself and record everything whilst your together.

Hi i just wanted to add my bit of exp on exactly the same issue
in my first case i filed a PSO on the grounds she was moving to stop contact.
The Judge at county court said

Want do you want me to do with this ?
He explained that the PSO was not valid as she was not moving to another country ie scotland she was planning to move to cornwall
500 miles away. I argued the point but the judge seemed reluctant to entertain the PSO and it got dropped.

It seems that if would indeed stop her moving to another country but not so much another part of the UK.
However i do know from research in the past the PSO has been granted when it was shown with supported evidence that the move was to obstruct contact. I think the only real chance of pushing this is to show very clearly that she is obstructing contact and have evidence to support. On a separate Note PR (parental responsibility ) does give you the right to stop a child from moving school. perhaps that might be an option ? I guess no solicitor is going to give you a yes or no answer. Perhaps you can research some case law in this country and find some examples that you could use as a skeleton argument on the grounds of obstructive contact.
I am really sorry you are in this boat and i know how you must feel. But dont give up and dont give in fight it right to the wire.
If you get denied then appeal the decision, infact you can appeal every decision the judge makes. Might not get changed but it will slow it down and perhaps open up other possibility's.

az

My own case, although a long time ago, was rather different.
I came here to the UK from another EU country where I met and married
my now ex husband ( UK citizen )
We came to the UK and sadly the marriage didn't last.
I had no idea about UK divorce law but agreed to get divorced here nevertheless.
When I finally received all the final divorce papers it shocked me to the core
of my being that I wasn't allowed to remove my children from England and Wales
unless approved by their father AND a judge.
Father objected to my children visiting my family abroad so Judge turned my
application down although I would have given any assurance they wanted.
I did manage to get them out of the country for the odd visit but I knew that I would go
to prison if caught.

I don't want to dampen your spirits but I think that she wants to be closer to
her family within England and Wales is not going to be enough reason for a judge refusing her the move.
Sorry for the long reply.

Let us know what happens please.
Take care
Kirsten

I would agree that a Specific Issue Order with preventing the children from moving schools is a much better choice. I guess you would have to show that the children are settled and doing well in their current setup and a change would cause unnecessary upset, which would particular as the children are going through a period of turmoil with their parents separating and where stability can be kept it should be. Just because it’s more convenient for your ex to go and live with her parents, doesn’t mean in anyway it’s in the best interest of the children. As az546 said, don't give up the fight...

I would agree with az's assessment - courts will generally only prevent a move if it is seen to be purely for the purpose of obstructing contact. If it is to be closer to family (ie a support network), then it is far more unlikely that the court will prevent a move, and I don't think that using being settled in a school would necessarily help the argument unless it was right in the middle of important exams. The court generally take the welfare of the children as the most important, but they will have consideration for the welfare of the parent with care also if that can be accommodated within reason.

Well, a lot has happened in a short period of time.

I decided to submit a PSO on friday, and the judge placed an order on my wife. I wondered if I had really done the right thing.

The order effectively prevents her from removing the children from the care of both parties and from changing schools until the next hearing which requires us both to be present (in a months time). So the length of the order is quite short. It also allowed her to visit her parent in York during half term, but she has to ensure children return for school.

Not sure what will happen at the next hearing, but will involve a Children and Family Advisor.

Anyway, following on from this, the following day I got a visit from local police. My wife had lodged a complaint of phone tapping. The police found no evidence of this, and said they would take no further action; I showed no signs of violent disorder, etc.

She admitted to them that she was intending to go to York and not come back. So I feel a lot better that I placed the order when I did!

So today she left our house with the kids. She's cleaned out her cupboards, so she's moved out for good. Not sure where she's actually moved out to. Children's stuff is mostly here still, but I doubt they will come back.

What to do next???

...she has effectively removed the children from your care, doesn't that contravene the interim PSO? I would call the court and get some clarification about this as she may be in breach, this will not go down well with the judge.

The order allows the children to visit over half term week. The children may come back for school here.

Not sure what "care of both parties" specifically means - I think it was intended to show that we were co-habiting equally caring for the children in the same home. If she comes back living somewhere locally, and children stay some nights with me, that's still "care of both parties".

So I probably have to wait until next monday to see what happens.

Does anyone who has been through hearings already know of any case laws that would benefit my case? This seems to be an important aspect to such cases - it could greatly help my case if there have been similar cases where the applicant has been successful in preventing the recipient from taking children away with them.

You are probably better speaking to a qualified solicitor for case law - can you clarify whether you have a solicitor - I see you consulted with a couple, but I'm not sure whether you engaged one. If not, we can ask the CCLC to comment on here.

I presume your ex did return the children to their school?

Thanks for the advice.

Yes, my wife did return with the children.
She has subsequently now started divorce proceedings, so I am in the process of appointing a solicitor.

Ah, thanks for clarifying. In which case, the CCLC aren't able to assist, but hopefully your solicitor can help on that.