[Solved] Overnight stays & court order

I think you should outline to her solicitor in writing that your child's safety is your responsibility and your only concern. List the breaches/no-shows/manipulation and verbal abuse that your son and your family is being subjected to, as you have here. Thank them for being honest with you about their clients continuing use of alcohol and in fact mixing it with her medication and state that you have spoken to the Social Worker who also confirmed your ex's continuing alcohol abuse.

As this goes against the current order and is putting your child at risk, state that overnight contact isn't appropriate in the circumstances and that you will be forwarding a copy of the letter to the judge that made the order to ask for guidance in this matter.

You can write to the judge, attaching the letter and ask for advice on how to manage the situation. You could request an early return to court for new directions as the interim order is clearly not working and for you to comply with the order would mean placing your child at serious risk of harm.

Best of luck

Thank you Mojo, the current order states 'overnight stays providing everything runs smoothly up until then (the date of the required overnight stay which has passed). I do not want to stop the contact as I feel that it is important that it continues and my long term goal would be to eradicate problems and be able to establish contact which would accommodate overnight stays but if she can't stay sober and adhere to the current order then I am not willing to place my son at risk by allowing that which could potentially put him at further risk. Trust is a big thing too, trusting her to not drink when she has been so lazy in her attempts so far.
Your response is once again appreciated 🙂

Whilst your fairness towards her is to be applauded, at the moment you need to be stringent and ensure that you are in control at all times, this means taking the lead as far as your child's safety is concerned...it's non negotiable.

By writing to her solicitor formally and updating the judge you are sending a firm message that you are, and will continue to act in the best interests of your child. If you wanted to soften it, you can say that you don't want to stop contact as it is important that your child maintains a relationship with his mother, but not at the cost of his safety.

Whilst you are mid case and she is trying to,get him back you must use all of her breaches to illustrate that he is better with you and an order that allows you to maintain control is what is best for your son. Hopefully in the future, if she gets her act together you can use your judgement and allow a more relaxed approach, but as it stands there's too much water gone under the bridge for you to ease up...just my opinion.

Thank you Mojo, I must admit it was hard at first to just think you know what she has done this and so is not going to see her son but looking at things in to perspective which I must thank you for it is now easy to look at things with a clear head and realise what is important here.
I am struggling with her reducing the days from 4 to 2 and blaming that on the confusion of my son. he isn't confused, I just feel that she doesn't want to commit to those days that she outlined in court and that for me is disappointing. Disappointing for my son that he is not worth more of her time. I understand that she has a lot of problems, I am still struggling to understand the extremity of these but I do understand how these have impacted on her life and that of my son's. Her solicitor is very intimidating but I also feel that he is very incompetent. Admitting to me that she has admitted drinking which has breached the order as well as mixing medication which was one of my initial points in the C100 application is negligent towards his client but has worked favourably towards me.

Can I ask, would I be able to submit a position statement / witness statement from my wife to be in the bundle or attached to my position statement? It is her that has cared for my son the majority of the time and also her that has dealt with the handovers on all occasions. I feel that her input would be valuable. We would also like to request that my wife has parental responsibility for my son should the judge favour that he continues to reside with me. Is this something I can do in the proposal to my son's future in my position statement?

Try not to worry too much about your son, children are far more resilient than we give them credit for. My own grandson was only three when he came to us because of his mothers lifestyle choices and we worried about the impact that his mothers behaviour would have... we gave him lots of love and reasssurance, and protected him by suspending contact when necessary and we made a point of not talking about it unless he initiated it. He is now a happy, well adjusted nine year old. I can't lie, his relationship with his mother has suffered, he only sees her once a week for tea and very rarely stays over, but this is his choice and she accepts it. Thankfully she has settled down, but the damage has been done, for which I'm sure she has her regrets.

Some solicitors will try to intimidate. It's just a tactic so do your best to ignore it...if you write to them formally and limit contact with them, it shouldn't be too difficult. The reason I suggested you "thank" them for being honest is to highlight the fact that they were incompetent to do so!

You can provide a brief position statement at the next hearing, but If you want to file a witness statement from your wife you will need permission to do so, you can write to the court asking for this, with your reasons for doing so.

You could also apply to have your wife included as a party to the proceedings, to do this you would need to submit form C2, if you feel her input would be valuable for the court, as you've outlined here, then it's likely they will agree, she would then be allowed in the courtroom and can be a part of the proceedings. When/if you make this application you can state on the form that you would like her to granted PR in the context of his step mother.

Thank you so much, firstly you have done great as I am sure that you already know. It is nice to hear such a happy story and a good ending. I too agree that the relationship with your grandson will have suffered with his mother but there is still contact which is a good thing.
The same applies to my son, he often doesn't want to go, he often states that he wishes she had died that night which is awful to hear from such a young child. To hear him telling my wife he wishes that she was his real mummy is heartbreaking in a good and a bad way. Of course, I had a relationship with his mother and for that it hurts that his relationship with his mum is not stronger but comforting that at the same time as caring for her own 2 children she has taken on my son and protected him, loved him and cared for him as her own, literally. She sat and spoke with my son and told him that he can speak to her whenever he wants and very often he comes down from bed and asks to talk to her. She never refuses but listens to what he has to say. She has introduced a worry book where he can write down his worries and also brought him a worry monster which he absolutely loves.

I have the email address for the court, can I write that way and ask permission for my wife to be able to submit a witness statement?

Would it be acceptable to submit the C2 form at this point to the court? Or would that not matter. Do I need to advise my ex's solicitor of my intentions or would he know anyway? My wife has taken on so much and has calmed the whole situation with my ex as she stated in court last time. I do think that her feelings would be valuable as It would be wrong of me to outline the number of breaches and add my opinion to these on what my wife has to say when it was her that has witnessed my ex's many mood swings, non attendance, drunk behaviour and arguments that my ex has initiated. God my wife has even stood there and supported my ex when she broke down and told her that she needs to be strong for my son.

Will it be an additional cost to submit the C2 form?

Thank you once again 🙂

In my experience with Solicitors they can be extremely incompetent.

Also though, I have dealt with some who have fed me information to detract from other issues.

So whilst appearing incompetent, they are in fact trying to steer the case with manipulation.

I don't want to make you overly paranoid but consider that there may be a reason why you were "given" this "gift" of an admission.

In my experience with Solicitors they can be extremely incompetent.

Also though, I have dealt with some who have fed me information to detract from other issues.

So whilst appearing incompetent, they are in fact trying to steer the case with manipulation.

I don't want to make you overly paranoid but consider that there may be a reason why you were "given" this "gift" of an admission.

Thank you for this insight, Her solicitor did start off by saying that she was slurring due to having had her medication which was a side effect. It was only when I responded that she was visibly drunk that he admitted it was 'just one drink'. I am confident that they have nothing to use upon me. I am completely clean, my wife is completely clean except from a GBH conviction when she was 14 (16 years ago), We have acted in my son's best interests at all times, allowing contact to happen and offering alternate times when she has not been available.

I have felt that he is trying to get me to go with overnight stays so that he can say "well he didn't have an issue with child A's safety when allowing an overnight stay". I have threatened that should she appear drunk again It would resort to us being back at square 1 with supported contact.

Do you have any ideas on what kinds of manipulation he could use?

My son and grandson moved out about a year after my son was granted custody... my grandson and I have an extremely close bond, his Dad was at work and it was us that went to his mothers house to collect him when she phoned up screaming down the phone to come and collect him....he got in the car and said " can we go home now Grandad". A week later she was demanding his return, that never happened. He may not remember the neglect he was subjected to (and I will never speak of it to him) but he knows our love is unconditional and he is always our first consideration....he's a special little guy!

To answer your questions, there's no problem emailing them, just remember to include the name of the judge that dealt with it. However if you're going to apply for your wife to be added to proceedings, it might be better to wait, if the application is approved she can then submit a position statement herself at the next hearing.

There's no problem with submitting the C2 at any point in the proceeedings. I can't remember definitely, It it's likely you would have to provide the other party with a copy of the C2 application, it should say if you need to do that on the form I think....I'll check. There is an additional fee to submit the form, I think it £90, but again not 100% on that.

...I wouldn't worry too much about any hidden agendas on her solicitors part, I can't think of anything he could gain by his admission.

Wow! He is indeed a special little guy, well done for doing the right thing. I find so many people criticised in making decisions like this. I had all kinds of messages from people telling me that I was stripping my son of his only lifelong bond he had with his mother, that I was doing wrong. So many people failed to see that I was doing what was best for my son. At times, very early on myself and my wife questioned wether we were doing the right thing as we had so many people intervening and telling us otherwise but we realise now that they were only being told what my ex wanted them to hear.
Unfortunately for me, my son knows everything. He knows exactly how many tablets she took that night, that she harmed herself, that she was drunk. It is very sad. Myself and my wife made a conscious decision to not mention any of this or any arrangements/dealings with solicitors when he is around and to date we have been successful in that. The trouble is, his mother doesn't care and still allows him to know whats going on. We started to see maladaptive behaviour from him, mimicking the behaviour that she would behave like from him. I understand that we can't all; be perfect parents but it is imperative that as parents and alas, grandparents we try our best and if our best is not good enough as in my ex's case then she needs to either ask for help or accept she cannot care for him to a standard that is acceptable. Sadly, this point has passed. Had she of admitted she was struggling then we may be in another situation now, a more happier one for her.

I cannot thank you enough for your advice, it has been taken and well received. You are a credit to this forum & also to my case 🙂

It's so sad that your boy has been so badly effected, but it sounds like you and your wife are doing all you can to help and support him....if he needs to talk about his feelings it's lovely that he feels able to do this with his step mum. She sounds like a lovely person.

Once the court case is over and you can all settle into a daily routine, the memories will fade and as he gets older he will be able to rationalise about his situation. Giving him lots of love and reassurance and for him to know he can talk about his feelings is an important part of his recovery.

Take no notice of those people that have no understanding of your sons situation... Motherhood is special, but no more than fatherhood. It was his mother that destroyed the bond she had with her son, not you. Being a mother doesn't give any woman the right to inflict pain and suffering on an innocent child, there has to be consequences.

The only person that matters in all this is your son, as adults it is our duty to love and protect our children and that's exactly what you and your wife are doing...well done.