CMS refused to provide me with arrears breakdown.

I am in exactly the same situation and have been asking the CMS to justify why my arrears have increased so much. I pay exactly every month what they tell me to pay yet from the 1/1/21 (when I was +£12 in credit) to 1/7/22 my arrears went to £-26,269.26. In fact from the 1/4/21 to the arrears leapt from £261 to £22,000 by 1/12/21. Nearly 22k in 8 months. 

I have been asking the CMS why now for nearly two years. Exactly a year ago I asked my new MP to get involved, and he has sent numerous letters all of which have just responded with a breakdown which show the increases but do not explain why. 

My MP had a meeting with the DWP who promised to investigate and two weeks ago I received their 'final' response which detailed 17 income and other variations since January 21. These did not add very much to the amount to be paid every month but all added huge amounts to the arrears. Yet again they did not detail what or why the variations were for, my income has not changed by + or - 25% since Jan 21. It did show however that they backdated my CMS case by three months for some unknown reason. 

A separate Subject Access Request shows more than 20 requests for investigations/variations by my ex-wife over the same period most of which were upheld, but I did not get a chance to correct or even challenge them. 

My next plan is to apply to Tribunal and ICE at the same time and with my MP's help have reduced the repayment of these supposed 'arrears' down to £20 a month, otherwise re-payment would just be compounding the problem. 

The CMS has at every stage obfuscated my queries to them simply because, I believe, my case has become so complicated with all the changes nobody is willing to take charge or ownership of the problem because it would mean many weeks of untangling all the variations as I have good evidence every single one of them is wrong. 

Stay strong. 

Posted by: @rich1

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So as the title suggests CMS have repeatedly refused to provide me with evidence of arrears. Now what gets me is the following.

In my case it says from 17/11/23 I should have paid £3,833.32 until today 29/10/24.

So I have paid £300 in December 23 and from January 24 until today I have paid £400 per month.

That totals £4,300which is a good £400 odd more than I should've.

Now also on 17/11/23 the alleged arrears on the case was £1296.93 so as I've been overpaying this amount SHOULD have gone down by roughly £400 odd, but in fact it's gone up to £13086.11?!?!? An increase of £122 odd.

So can someone enlighten me as to how I'm supposed to proceed with gaining this information?

CMS have failed at every point, ombudsman also doesn't listen, my MP has mugged me off I've even contacted the secretary of state and the PM and got no response....are we just doomed to accept fraudulent behaviour from those in a position of power? I'm guessing the only way this may gain traction is if enough parents either come together and protest or (whichever deity you pray to) forbid another father takes far more drastic measures and decides not to carry on with life.

If anyone has any information on how to get this information that would be amazing. As I said CMS have outright refused to provide me with the evidence of arrears and are expecting me to provide them with proof of payments. If I'm correct they have made the accusations therefore they have to show me where these alleged figures came from?

 

Ps. I have provided them with confirmation of every payment made since January 24 as I have been asking for these arrears figures. So I've still overpaid by £166.68 which still doesn't make sense of the increase of arrears.

Hi did you fill out a right of access form?

DWP should send out the information after you request it:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/request-your-personal-information-from-the-department-for-work-and-pensions

if you have not done so, can log complaint to correspondence@dwp.gov.uk and complaintsreviewteam@dwp.gov.uk 

So I've been on the phone this afternoon for over an hour, I asked about how much I should've paid in the period of 17/11/23 and the call handler stated I should've paid over £4000 when I corrected him and stated the online portal tells me I should have paid £3833.23 he became very defensive and started to speak in an unpleasant manner. He then tried to tell me the breakdown of the payments. He stated from January I should have paid £383.27 I said no the information I have is £393.27. he then said no it's £383.27 I then repeated what he said to ensure I heard him and he stated that's not what he said. This went on a few more times when I lost it, told him to pass me to his supervisor so they can listen to the call but he then hung up. I'm now on hold again for over an hour to get this sorted. 

These call handlers need to be sacked as this is playing with people's lives and it's absolutely impossible to get any answers from them.

Like @AB they can't provide me with any figures that match. This guy was being downright obstructive and lied that much I'm surprised he has a job!

@rich1 man I sympathise with you. The csa are Ruthless..Ruthless..! They drove me to the edge. I was reading your words and thought I'd sign up so I could reply. My case is a bit different but nonetheless long and frustrating..My partner now deals with them for me as I have no patience with them whatsoever..my recent run in with them has come because I asked them for help as my eldest son had stopped going to college and done his exams and has a good pay..so I informed them of this...long story short I now have an attachment of earnings paying more for one child than I was for two...!..beggars belief..!.because my ex opened the case..we as men ..or the paying person do not

.in my experience have a leg to stand on. Even if we did they'd take that aswell..they sent me a letter saying the attachment was gonna start on the 19th December..but they have gone,  nah we'll just crack straight on with it..it's a draining and frustratingly futile experience that is designed to wear you down so you just except your fate..but we have to not accept their nonsense and rebuff their contradicting language they spew at us..

So in short mate I feel your pain..and may the force be with you..☘️

So, after over an hour on hold the first advisor hung up, the second advisor rang me back after another hour on hold which was decent of him to do considering I don't have a number saved to file (generally that's the excuse I get when it cuts out normally) that conversation lasted just under another hour so approximately 3 hours in total in one day and I still don't have concrete answers.

The upside, the second advisor who listened and looked at the case has said that the £3833.23 is what my payments would be if I paid the next two months (November and December) so I went through the payments made for the year and he has confirmed that I have in fact overpaid and he is going to have the arrears looked at and adjusted (he couldn't tell me where they come from).

So from January to October I paid £400 per month and that's when I started sending proof of payments in. I told him I'd accept that as I haven't provided them with December 2023 payment (which was £300) I haven't taken it into consideration, but even just payments from January onwards has proven that I have paid more than they have asked for.

As for the increase in arrears, the advisor stated that this was because they have done it in advance and it'll adjust when the next payment is made....this still doesn't make sense (I didn't want to push or waste any more if my time as I already wasted enough of it).

If I'm paying regular maintenance of £383 (and whatever pence) then the rest of it should go to reducing the alleged arrears which means the arrears balance should still go down not up. And this is where they are artificially inflating false figures. No one is willing to stand up to them.

I've complained right up to a tribunal and got nowhere. As I've stated previously I've even complained directly to the PM and Secretary of  State who I've not had a response from, even the new Secretary of State hasn't acknowledged me. MP's just give me the same rubbish I already know and side with the CMS anyway so it's pointless now.

Not sure how but someone has to make them accountable in a court so that they can be dismissed or change their ways so that the non resident parent isn't being screwed over.

My issue is my ex poisoned my child's mind. She has full custody and therefore maximum influence. My child had told me numerous times they didn't want anything to do with me. I fought hard enough for a while but decided I didn't want to force anything for fear of resentment. I done as they asked and backed off. My thought process is, any resentment formed is now done by her own accord as she's the one who doesn't want anything to do with me (apart from money which she has clearly stated she is owed....got that from her mother).

A financial penalty needs to be incurred on vindictive poisonous women like this, who manipulates and uses kids as a form of income (she did this with her previous partner). This way the mother can't manipulate the child into not going to their father's and thus gaining maximum money.

There is absolutely no financial incentive for a mother to allow the father to see the child as the more the father sees their child the less money the mother can gain.

Sorry going off on a tangent as it's not just my case that seems to be complex and something needs to be done about it and fast.

@rich1 Noel Wilcox... https://youtu.be/V2UFc_KTUVQ?si=jr7Bqf0E6pVm4fyV

Give it a watch, this guy is going for them..he is the person who we have been praying for. 

It made me feel bi better about thing's.

Hang in there..☘️☘️

So an update as I've had another payment made. I don't think the advisors even know what's going on and how the finances are worked out. As per previous post now the arrears have gone down but the total I should've paid has gone up (still overpaid).

Payments I should've made has jumped from £3383 to £4206 an increase of over £800.

The arrears have gone down from £13086 to £12694 a decrease of just under £400.

So the last advisor said the £3383 was made until the end of the case effectively so why has this increased? And why does the arrears not reflect the true payments?

I think I need to get a solicitor involved in this and take legal action as this is coming across as very shady. Refusal to provide proof of arrears and figures not adding up as well as information being given not making sense.

My only concern is where the £800 increase is involved maybe this is a live payment (as I thought it was) and not what the full years payment is. I have had a deductions order put on me incorrectly this month but only for £767 which is as close to £800 as it'll get but this still doesn't answer the extra discrepancy (£30 odd). And if this is the case why hasn't it been adjusted correctly as my last conversation was that they had cancelled it the same day I told them and provided evidence I shouldn't be on one as I had made payment.

It's all just iffy and I don't really want any more hassle but I'm just one case and as small amount as it may sound....they handle millions of cases so that's a possible increase of billions....brewsters millions springs to mind (that's one way they artificially inflate their numbers but that's another issue which I may or may not touch on on another post if I haven't already).